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 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor

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+22
Gabriele Maruca
Jason White
Marco Lenarduzzi
Ashar Firdaus
Gilles Taux
Juha Bos
John Fuqua
David Jundt
Jason Fitch
Jacob Fredriksson
Timo Vermeersch
Filippo Marazzi
Brian Janik
Marie de Lacrowe
Lennart Groessl
François Remmen
Alberto Ibañez
David Sabre
Lukáš Vydra
Richard Coxon
Richard Wilks
Pascal Mikula
26 posters
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AuthorMessage
David Sabre
Racing Legend
David Sabre


Number of posts : 5340
Age : 57
Location : england
Registration date : 2012-02-25

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue 30 Apr 2019 - 21:27

Sorry but veh files are the way to go.
For every 3d model that you will have you need to make LOD (Level Of Detail) models. LODs are usually MAX, MED & LOW detail models. If you have a lot more 3d models then you will also need 3 x each 3d model. Thats a lot more work making LOD models. You will also end up with a very large filesize mod.
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Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue 30 Apr 2019 - 21:36

David Sabre wrote:
Sorry but veh files are the way to go.
For every 3d model that you will have you need to make LOD (Level Of Detail) models. LODs are usually MAX, MED & LOW detail models. If you have a lot more 3d models then you will also need 3 x each 3d model. Thats a lot more work making LOD models. You will also end up with a very large filesize mod.
Yikes.

Yeah, I thought so already. So that'd mean ridding the Tyrrell (at least, idk if there are any other cars with the same method) of those 3d models, or at least their different materials. Given that I want to keep the mod as small a filesize as possible while keeping it FPS-friendly, I think making a million models for each car, each GP, is just a complete dumb-assery.

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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http://classicmotorsporthub.org
Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeWed 1 May 2019 - 1:06

CHECKPOINT
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_004
01.05.2019 01:30:28

Today has been a day filled as much with success as with failure - however, a change of approach has finally given me what I needed the most: A plan to success.
I've worked on every single veh file of every single existing car, making them available for the game, and increasing the maximum number of opponents in the rFm to 40 - since, at the moment, there are 41 cars in-game. (Believe me, there are going to be more in the future.)


Anyway, every car has got a working T-cam, working instruments, working instruments in the T-Cam and the information necessary so that even the newest newcomer would know at what point which car attended which race.
Here's an example from the in-game menu:


Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-01_01-34-45-48


Emilio de Villota's March 821-RM07. Entered by LBT Racing Team March from Round 5 to Round 9.
On the left, the usual bits and pieces of information. On the right, added to the vehicle description, the engine designation (every car has its authentic engine description, despite every 3 liter car using the current LE engine and every 1.5 liter car using the current LE turbo engine. More on that later), the model of the car, with constructor and engine supplier (as you can see, I'll need to fix that in the March 821's cases), and the rounds of the 1982 championships it entered!
You would see, if you took a look at my development files, that some teams will not have covered all rounds with their current cars, as it is the case that some cars are out-right missing. David Sabre mentioned in the very beginning that, of the teams, only the Ensign team is missing; however, of most existing teams, there are plenty of chassis, upgrades, and even whole models missing. I will aim to fix that, as for some cars, there are assets, 3D models, shadows, etc. present. However, I'll need a lot of time for that.


Of course, you'll need to hear the car to feel it.
As can be imagined, the Cosworth-powered cars share the same sound file; the Cosworth-DFV V8 scream that we're all familiar with.
Ligier (with their Matra-Talbot MS81 V12) and Alfa-Romeo (with the 1260 V12) both have V12 N/A engines instead of Cosworth V8s; however the Ligier has its own sound file and sound bits, as does the Alfa. The Alfa screams like a banshee, similar to what the old Ferrari 312T would sound like; or the Brabham-Alfa BT46, if you remember that, while the Ligier JS17 has more of a humble growl to it.
The turbos are a different story.
As of now, of the four turbocharged car makes (Renault RE30B, Ferrari 126C2, Brabham-BMW BT50, Toleman-Hart TG183), there are three sound files. Unfortunately (or fortunately, at the moment), the Brabham and Toleman have to share their sounds; however, it makes some sense, since both the BMW M12/13 and the Hart 415T are Inline-4 engines. (It is on my checklist, though, to try and find bits and pieces to put a Hart 415T engine sound together, if that is possible)


Now, to sum this little dev update (Title totally not stolen from Camshaft Software and their Automation "Little Dev Update" series), here is my current checklist, together with a list of cars which exist, cars which are missing, cars which are missing but which have assets scattered around in various MAS archives, and cars which would require a complete rebuild, mostly from scratch. Plus, there are some points where I'd plan to release versions of the mod, with their estimated (not promised) release date.








(I have no idea why the editor inserts a million empty lines here when it posts the message or when I switch editor mode; please don't rip my head off for that kthx  :aie: )















TeamExisting Cars 
Missing Cars 
Alfa-Romeo182182T, 179D
ArrowsA5A4
ATSD5None
BrabhamBT50-BMWBT49D-Ford
EnsignNoneN180B, N181
Ferrari126C2126CK, 126C2 w/new susp., 126C2B
FittipaldiF9F8D
LigierJS17JS19
LotusType 91Type 87B
March821811 (but not really, it was only ever entered as a T-car)
McLaren-FordMP4/1BNone
OsellaFA1CNone (FA1B was only ever entered as T-car)
RenaultRE30BNone
TheodoreTY02TR3
Toleman-HartTG183TG181B, TG181C
Tyrrell-Ford011None
Williams-FordFW07CFW07D, FW08, FW08B
Code:
Assets exist for:
Williams FW07D, FW08, FW08B
Ligier JS19
Ferrari 126C2 New Suspension
Alfa-Romeo 182T

Assets missing:
Alfa-Romeo 179D
Arrows A4
Brabham BT49D
Ensign N180B, N181
Ferrari 126C2B
Lotus Type 87B
Theodore TR3
Toleman TG181B/C


Checklist ( [X] = finished ):
Bring existing cars in-game and let them show up [X]
Fix existing cars' gen files for T-Cam [ ]
Fix T-cam position for better view on certain cars [ ]
Bring 0.93 HE engine + gears to fitting cars [ ]
Research and possibly fix faulty engine files, add increased wear/increased qualifying power to turbos [ ]
Add textures/liveries to cars, sort out by appearance, make applicable through vehicle files for AI [ ]
Create credits text [ ]
Rework mod UI, remove Varjanta badging, add chat box to race screen [ ]
-----------------FIRST RELEASE POSSIBLE STILL AS BETA FOR FIRST JUDGING---------------------------(est.: mid-late May, more likely June or July)
Create work folders for missing cars with existing assets [ ]
Make "missing" cars with existing assets appear in-game with 0.95 LE physics [ ]
Find assets for missing cars [ ]
Create first 3D models of missing cars, one-by-one [ ]
Create skins for missing cars, one-by-one [ ]
Make them appear in-game using existing drivers [ ]
Create missing driver talent files [ ]
Associate missing drivers with their respective cars [ ]
Create accurate HDV's, engine ini's, gear files [ ]
Fix invisible mirror bug [ ]
Find sound assets for Hart L4T engine, create sfx for Toleman [ ]
-------------------POSSIBLE RELEASE OF FIRST NON-BETA VERSION 1.0------------------------(est.: 2020 at best; very late 2019 with a team)
Check if anything's still missing [ ]
Fix that [ ]
Add anything that may not have made it in initial release, fix any upcoming bugs/issues [ ]
-------------------FUTURE RFACTOR RELEASES----------------------- (est.: unknown)
{
CONCURRENTLY
Start porting to Automobilista [ ]
Implement turbocharging for 1.5l engines[ ]
Implement tire pick-up, flat spots [ ]
-------------------AMS RELEASE------------------- (est.: 2021; maybe late 2020 with a team)
}

TRACK WORK
Find authentic versions of Paul Ricard, Hockenheim, Brands Hatch, Jacarepagua [ ]
Rework tracks, rename assets [ ]
Make GPC79 tracks standalone, separate from GPC79 [ ]
Rework Caesars Palace, improve AIW, consult test races offline/online [ ]
Major rework on Long Beach 82, possible re-start from scratch [ ]
 - Turn 1,2
 - Uphill,downhill sections
 - Pit area
 - Section between pit area and start line
 - Textures, AIW, test sessions
Create unique loading screens for all 16 tracks with information [ ]
Attempt at creating full season in rFm [ ]
Attempt at running full season offline in rF [ ]
--------------TRACK PACK RELEASE-------------------- (est. unknown)


And some pictures!

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-01_01-58-12-30 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-01_01-58-52-45
McLaren-Ford MP4/1B - John Watson (GB)      Williams-Ford FW07C - Keke Rosberg (FIN)


Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-01_01-59-24-58 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-01_01-59-35-16
Lamborghini Countach LP-400 Safety Car         Lancia Stratos Safety Car


Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Unknown
Full Team List (as of now) + Pace Car List

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 15:50

CHECKPOINT(?)




So, the graphical part of the mod is finished.
Kind of.
All 41 cars/drivers are in the game, all have working and re-worked T-cams and updated gen files. Everything you need to see in the T-cam will be rendered. I will post pictures in a follow-up post!

I still haven't gotten to re-work the Tyrrell 011 with its three different cockpits, three different materials, etc. but I'll do that later. It's not as easy as just deleting them, even though I could do that. And then remove every mention of the cockpits and parts in the upgrade files. Believe me, this mod is a little messy.

Anyway, the following things have been finished:

Bring existing cars in-game and let them show up [X] (41 unique vehicle files, most of them share LE physics still)
Fix existing cars' gen files for T-Cam [X] (As said before, most cars were missing things like the dashboard, the cockpit panels, the windshields, etc. so I added those to the gen file.)
Fix T-cam position for better view on certain cars [X] (Some cars, mostly those from 0.93, had the T-cam somewhere either behind the helmet, or way too high, way too low, you get the drill. They're all fixed and should be usable. They're not perfect, but they're definitely better than before.)
Fix MAS archives, one car per mas, per folder, per team for now [X] (Some cars, e.g. the Ligiers, the ATS, the Tyrrell and the Williams, had more than one model of car in their mas file and their upgrades. It's something Dave Sabre "complained" about, and I see it the same way. I rebuilt the mas files of such teams, removing front wings and their respective references from the ATS D5 and Tyrrell 011, since the upgrade files stated that the cars never had a front wing, but 'because it's an LE', the devs gave them front wings, yada yada. I removed all references of the Williams FW08 from the Williams team. For now, all they have is the FW07C/D. However, even those use FW08 parts, mostly at the back, so I didn't rebuild the mas yet. However, I made separate folders and assets for the FW08 and FW08B, so they're no longer referenced in the game and are thus no longer selectable. Purely for development reasons.)
Fix engine sound files and references [X] (Ehhh that was the easiest part. Just re-naming the LE sfx files and editing their respective references. Though, I must admit, the fact I put Renault 0.93 sound files in the folder and had a 0.95 sfx messed up the Renault so badly, so I fixed it. It doesn't sound like a very whistly something-else, but rather a more aggressive bastard child between a Renault and a BMW. Sounds authentic, in my opinion. Now the Alfa sounds like an Alfa, the Matra like a Matra, the Ferrari like a Ferrari, the BMW like a BMW, the Renault like a Renault and the Cosworth..well, like a Cosworth.)


The reason I say the graphical part is mostly finished, is because some stuff I just can't fix yet because I don't have the skill to.
I'd still have to check the 3d-models of every car, possibly re-arranging them and all that shit because as mentioned by various people before, they're very polygon-rich.
I did a count in 3DSimEd and, using the Ferrari 126C2 as it appeared in Long Beach, the car had a whopping 45625 polygons, or as they're called in 3dSimEd, faces. Every single one being rendered. Now, I'm no expert, but I can tell (and feel, with a full field on the grid) that that's way too many. Adding to that, every single car has around that amount of polygons. (Not including any extra front/rear wings like on the ATS or Renault)


Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Unknown


I have no idea how to reduce the amount. I mean, obviously you can delete some, collapse some, all that good stuff, but that'd most likely ruin the shape of the cars.
Then again, I could also merge some object together. I don't think the engine needs to be a separate entity. It can be connected to the rear of the cockpit. Or, I can imagine the brakes being connected to the suspension arms. Stuff like that. I'd need some advice on that, maybe a helping hand or two. But that lay in the future.

Anyway


I've now started work on (partly) the physics.
What would I still need to do in order to get ready for a first "release"of my development version?
Not too many things, actually.

Bring 0.93 HE engine + gears to fitting cars [ ] (Working on that right now)
Research and possibly fix faulty engine files, add increased wear/increased qualifying power to turbos [ ] (Working on that as I write this)
Add textures/liveries to cars, sort out by appearance, make applicable through vehicle files for AI [ ] (Finished for Raul Boesel's March 821, my goal is to have this done for every team/car that used multiple liveries during the season)
Rework mod UI, remove Varjanta badging, add chat box to race screen [ ] (Some very well-needed work. The UI itself is not very good. I like the showroom, I really do. It's creative and not very FPS-heavy. But the aesthetics of the UI with the weird buttons on the top and bottom, and the lack of a chat box at least offline is in need of being improved.)


Depending on my progress, I may be able to upload a first version around the end of this month. I'm not sure yet, though. Depends on my research on engines, the gear ratios and liveries, and especially the UI work, because I honestly have absolutely no clue how those UI files are structured. (Deleting those UI files and hoping it'd revert to the standard UI didn't work, just threw me tons of gMotor errors.)


Anyway (2),

I'd like to ask a question here. Since I'm currently researching the engines used in the 1982 season, including older model DFV's, is there a place to look at for exact specifications, including power curves, peak power/torque output, etc.? 
I'm currently working on the Alfa Tipo 1260 V12, and just looking at the peak power figures, I noticed that the existing 0.93 engine file is very inaccurate. 

According to https://www.ultimatecarpage.com/spec/4812/Alfa-Romeo-182-F1.html , the 1260 had 540 bhp @ 12,000 rpm and 343 Nm @ 9,500 rpm.
According to CarStats, the ini file gives the engine 536 hp @ 12,500 rpm (the limiter is set at 12,300 for good measure) and 324 Nm @ 11,500 rpm. 
You see where it makes me go apeshit, basically.

My question stands, is there an answer? I'd really love to know.
Cheers!

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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David Sabre
Racing Legend
David Sabre


Number of posts : 5340
Age : 57
Location : england
Registration date : 2012-02-25

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 16:20

It sounds like you are making good progress :top: but don't forget your real life.

I'll have a look through some magazines that I have to see if there is any info about specifications.
There's not really any one place to find car specification but maybe someone here has the 1982 f1 Autocourse book.
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Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 16:25

David Sabre wrote:
It sounds like you are making good progress :top: but don't forget your real life.

I'll have a look through some magazines that I have to see if there is any info about specifications.
There's not really any one place to find car specification but maybe someone here has the 1982 f1 Autocourse book.
Thank you! I can actually feel it starting to take some shape now, and as Alberto said, the feeling is amazingly rewarding. Makes me unironically happy despite the fact I've been going through rough emotional shit for basically three months now.
Talking about real life.. Yeah, I should really study for my Maths exam which I have tomorrow!  :aie:

However, I'll also need to get me some more tools. PhysicsEditor, maybe there's a tool for editing or looking at the tires, all that stuff - maybe even a handy HDV editor, who knows.

Pictures coming as soon as they're up on Discord!

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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http://classicmotorsporthub.org
Richard Coxon
Racing Legend
Richard Coxon


Number of posts : 16590
Age : 34
Location : Sheffield, England
Registration date : 2012-06-29

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 16:46

Well done Pascal :top:

Be proud of yourself Smile

_________________
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 462
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Richard Wilks
Racing Legend
Richard Wilks


Number of posts : 2212
Age : 38
Location : Portugal
Registration date : 2015-01-07

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 17:09

Well i will be honest, that seems a lot of polygons, but compared with stuff in newer sims, or even some default content in AMS, that isn't that much.

Out of curiosity Pascal, what cars are now in the mod, and what cars are missing, from the 1982 entrants?

_________________
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 700

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Ik0uEqBjC0LKiLMueGfA

Join the current HSO team as we move to ISO in 2020!
https://historicsimracing.123.st/t4220-important-announcement-for-the-2020-season
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Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 17:22

The Class of 1982 (so far)

(Images on the left: Swingman; Images on the right: T-Cam without any freecam movement)


Alfa-Romeo Tipo 182:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_000 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_001


Ferrari 126C2:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_002 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_003



McLaren MP4/1B:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_004 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_005



March 821-RM07:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_006 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_007



March 821-RM08 (notice cockpit cut-out not as deep, hence the double-post):
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_008 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_009



Lotus Type 91:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_010 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_011



Fittipaldi F9:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_012 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_013



ATS D5:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_014 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_015



Williams FW07C:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_016 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_017



Renault RE30B:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_018 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_019



Tyrrell 011:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_020 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_021



Arrows A5:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_022 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_023



Brabham BT50:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_024 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_025



Osella FA1C:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_026 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_027



Toleman TG183:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_028 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_029



Ligier JS17:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_030 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_031



Theodore TY02:
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_032 Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 GRAB_033

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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http://classicmotorsporthub.org
Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 17:26

Richard Wilks wrote:
Well i will be honest, that seems a lot of polygons, but compared with stuff in newer sims, or even some default content in AMS, that isn't that much.

Out of curiosity Pascal, what cars are now in the mod, and what cars are missing, from the 1982 entrants?

I'm trying to judge the performance on my own laptop, which can run AMS somewhat well, but this mod with a full field gets low FPS, while I'm comparing it to things like CART88, which runs very smoothly on both rF and AMS.

About your question, I'm sure the images above answer it  Very Happy


But here's another list, just to be safe.
Note: Assets are already there for the following entries:
Ferrari 126C2 Suspension, Ligier JS19, Williams FW07D, FW08, FW08B, Alfa-Romeo 182T.

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Unknown
I've also got a list somewhere in which I wrote which car was used by whom at what round, but I think listing all that doesn't matter right now; it's going to matter when it comes to associating the cars with the round filter.

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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Filippo Marazzi
Club Driver
Filippo Marazzi


Number of posts : 160
Age : 52
Location : Varese, Italy
Registration date : 2016-11-05

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 17:43

Great work Pascal :clap:

_________________
Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 819
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Pascal Mikula
Racing Legend
Pascal Mikula


Number of posts : 1155
Age : 21
Location : Classic Motorsport Hub
Registration date : 2016-01-04

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 18:41

Thank you Filippo!

But hey, what better thing to watch while working on this mod than this..?  :cowboy:

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Unknown

_________________
2016 1000km of Kyalami Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 WEC1983_pAG1
2017 Grand Prix of Italy Winner!  Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 ASenna_01
2018 Indianapolis 500 Pole Position Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 USAC74_14
2018 Can-Am Challenge at Riverside Winner! Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 7McLaren
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 18:42

There's nothing like a german mind to organize things efficiently :D

45.000 polygons was an unacceptable shitload some years ago when rFactor was young, but with today's graphics cards and processing power it's no longer that crazy. Of course the models are not well optimized but still, don't be too worried about that, there are ways to make things easier for the processor and VGA

Quote :
I have no idea how to reduce the amount. I mean, obviously you can delete some, collapse some, all that good stuff, but that'd most likely ruin the shape of the cars.
Then again, I could also merge some object together. I don't think the engine needs to be a separate entity. It can be connected to the rear of the cockpit. Or, I can imagine the brakes being connected to the suspension arms. Stuff like that. I'd need some advice on that, maybe a helping hand or two.

Merging them will do nothing, just put in a single object what is now two or more different ones, but the total number of polygons will be the same. Also, don't try to put together moving parts (Brake discs, wheels, spindles, suspensions) because you could easily screw up the way they move visibly. 

In general, what 3D models have are "LODs" or "Level of details" i.e. lower polygon versions of the same object that are displayed as it gets further and further away from the camera and you can no longer notice that. 

Here is a sample from our Indycar mod March 88 GEN file:


Quote :
MeshFile=88C_Body_Max.gmt CollTarget=False HATTarget=False LODIn=(0.0) LODOut=(150.0) Receiver=True
MeshFile=88C_Body_Med.gmt CollTarget=False HATTarget=False LODIn=(150.0) LODOut=(350.0) ShadowReceiver=True
MeshFile=88C_Body_Low.gmt CollTarget=False HATTarget=False LODIn=(350.0) LODOut=(1000.0) ShadowReceiver=True

So the high polygon model is displayed from zero to 150 metres, then dissapears and the mid polygon model appears from there to 350 metres. Beyond that, only the low polygon version of the body appears, and at 1000 meters it also disappears and nothing is rendered at all. 

The mod should have those LODs, but if it doesn't, then the trick is to ensure that as many parts of the cars as possible are no longer rendered where you can't anyway see them. 

For example, let's say the exhausts are a separate part. You do not need it rendered when a car is like 150 meters away, because it is almost impossible to notice. So what you do is this:


Quote :
MeshFile=88C_exhausts.gmt CollTarget=False HATTarget=False ShadowCaster=(True, Solid, 64, 64) LODIn=(0.0) LODOut=(150.0) ShadowReceiver=True

There you go, once the car is 150 meters away, all the polygons from the exhausts will disappear and not be rendered. 

If you go carefully through the parts of the cars you will likely recognize which ones can't be seen when at some distance, and you can start having them disappear from screen without any loss of visual quality.

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Pascal Mikula
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 18:58

Oh hey, that's what those numbers in LODin and LODout mean! That makes sense!  cheers cheers cheers

Now I gotta start working and fixing the T-cam objects since most of them have LODout's of like.....idk more than they need. Not that it really impacts the performance, but now it's on my mind and I don't want to forget about that! lol!

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 19:09

Anyway, about the LOD models.

I noticed already that that is much implemented in the mod before I started working on it. However, some cars only have one LOD model, some parts only have one LOD model, while some have multiple, up to three. So I'm not that sure how much can be done there. I'd rather try and concentrate on the sheer amount of polygons.

Thinking of it.. I know some parts I can combine, at least on the Ferrari.
Anyway, merging parts won't do much, as you said, Alberto. But I think there could be a possibility to erase the polygons that overlap each other when the parts get combined in the gen anyways. Then again, if I'm lucky, it'd only erase maybe a hundred or so polys per car, but I'd say every bit counts.

My goal in total would be to have a full field, with every single car entered, on the grid at the same time and not have complete stutter, on my system. If that gets achieved, I'm sure it'd be way more than ready to be ported to AMS and to be used online, with a full entry list.

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 19:21

If you look at the T-cam photos, you'll see on some cars that you can look through the mirrors. That's what happens when they're turned off. 

I'd like to have the usual grey texture there. I tried editing the Ferrari's mirrors once, but somehow the mirrors then ended up underneath the car with no explanation as to why.
Meaning, I have no idea what tells the game what model goes where. Does a scn file in the mas tell the game that?

But yeah. That's something I'd need to fix still.

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David Sabre
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 19:31

Pascal Mikula wrote:
Does a scn file in the mas tell the game that?
The GMT files store the information about the models including its pivot point. The pivot point is the point that the GMT will rotate around. The most GMT models (Body, wings, suspension, etc) the pivot point is set to 0,0,0. For wheels or tyres the pivot point is at the centre of the wheel or tyre model.
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Alberto Ibañez
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 19:50

Quote :
there could be a possibility to erase the polygons that overlap each other when the parts get combined in the gen anyways.

That won't happen. You will have two polygons in the same location. 

If some cars have lods, then implement them. If they don't, then use the technique I told you. Forget the merging thing, you are losing time there and also it will later prevent you from using the idea I pointed out about making the parts disappear in the distance.

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Lukáš Vydra
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 19:50

Pascal Mikula wrote:
Images on the left: Swingman; Images on the right: T-Cam without any freecam movement
I think it's obvious, but just to be sure ... does other cameras (on the Insert key) work too?

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 20:17

Alberto Ibañez wrote:
Quote :
there could be a possibility to erase the polygons that overlap each other when the parts get combined in the gen anyways.

That won't happen. You will have two polygons in the same location. 

If some cars have lods, then implement them. If they don't, then use the technique I told you. Forget the merging thing, you are losing time there and also it will later prevent you from using the idea I pointed out about making the parts disappear in the distance.
The LOD's are already implemented. And about the other parts, they're implemented too with LODIn and LODout. The only parts that are rendered at very high distance are the outer cockpit shells, basically. I think there isn't that much needed to do, until I get to the Ensign.

Quote :
I think it's obvious, but just to be sure ... does other cameras (on the Insert key) work too?

Of course. You have the normal cockpit view with all the instruments, steering wheel, etc., then the T-cam, and a bumper/nose cone cam.

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 22:38

Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 RFactor_2019-05-02_23-35-39-02
I was bored... so what would keep me from creating a new work folder, gen files, mas files, and all that nice jazz to bring you all a little jewel?

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Juha Bos
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 22:46

Keep up the good work Pascal! :top:

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 22:48

Juha Bos wrote:
Keep up the good work Pascal! :top:
Thank you; I will do that!

Now.. time to de-bug that FW08B.
It needs a moving steering wheel.. it needs some objects in the T-cam.. and it should better not keep crashing the game when I go to any outside camera!

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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu 2 May 2019 - 23:08

Oh well. Seems like I can't fix the FW08B at the moment.

Problems are: 
- Steering wheel either doesn't turn, doesn't show, or the pivot point is wrong. I did edit it in the gmt, but it just won't turn around the center point. Idk why. 
- The game crashes as soon as any outside camera is activated. Swingman or Trackside. Doesn't matter; the game crashes. I can't tell why, since the trace file doesn't record any errors that cause the crash. Actually, it doesn't crash when the rear wheels (all four of them) and the rear suspension is detached, by means of an accident. Weird. So something's gotta be wrong with the rear suspension stuff in the gen file...
I'm happy that the car is in the game now, and has its dedicated parts, mas files, gen files, etc. but I'm not sure where i might have missed a line or two in a gen file.

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Alberto Ibañez
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PostSubject: Re: Mod F1 1982 for rFactor   Mod F1 1982 for rFactor - Page 5 Icon_minitimeFri 3 May 2019 - 8:31

Quote :
- The game crashes as soon as any outside camera is activated. Swingman or Trackside. Doesn't matter; the game crashes. I can't tell why, since the trace file doesn't record any errors that cause the crash. Actually, it doesn't crash when the rear wheels (all four of them) and the rear suspension is detached, by means of an accident. Weird. So something's gotta be wrong with the rear suspension stuff in the gen file...
I'm happy that the car is in the game now, and has its dedicated parts, mas files, gen files, etc. but I'm not sure where i might have missed a line or two in a gen file.

Use the spinner GEN file contents as starter (After all, you can see the car in the spinner) and add the cockpit and steering wheel section of the normal GEN file, then start adding one by one the parts and see which one causes the crash.  If you already suspect that the suspension has something to do, comment it out in the GEN file and see if it works now.

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